View Full Version : Department Authorized Firearms
I don't get it. Why is it that departments only allow certain weapons and manufacturers, especially if it's at the officer's expense? Why should the officers have to buy specific firearms at their own expense when they may not even want that specific option? What's in it for the departments? I just think it's ridiculous. "If you want a shotgun or an AR, you're gonna have to buy it yourself, but you can only buy _______ because that's all we allow." If it pisses me off, I'm sure it pisses the officers off.
spikes40
10-02-2008, 06:58 PM
only a guess but i would say because dept. need standardization. If an officer decides he want a .44...the first criminal shredded by it..the lawyer will be claim cruel and unusual punishment. If a dept is standarized, they cant claim excessive force used...just my .02 FWIW
That said, I agree with you
I disagree with the rules of what they can carry. I hear quite a bit of them want something else and are always jumping on rumors of being able to change what they have.
doug5336
10-02-2008, 08:12 PM
I don't get it. Why is it that departments only allow certain weapons and manufacturers, especially if it's at the officer's expense? Why should the officers have to buy specific firearms at their own expense when they may not even want that specific option? What's in it for the departments? I just think it's ridiculous. "If you want a shotgun or an AR, you're gonna have to buy it yourself, but you can only buy _______ because that's all we allow." If it pisses me off, I'm sure it pisses the officers off.
Dave,
I could write a novel on my department's policy & procedures, regarding weapons. You probably wouldn't want to hear it, and if you did, you would be asking yourself, how it could possibly make any sense! :D
I think it's mostly for standardization and servicing. Keep in mind that alot of departments still service the weapons for LEOs. So if you've got a Kimber 1911 and everyone else has a Glock or plastic pistol, it's harder and more expensive to keep multiple parts, pieces, etc on hand.
chrismia
10-03-2008, 10:05 AM
as long as the officer can pass his shooting test with a specific handgun and prove that he can handle it properly, let him use what he/she wants.
if they are going to be more comfortable or it makes them feel more confident using something they like...why not?
BrooklynBacon
05-30-2010, 03:58 AM
Every time I've ever brought this up, I've always heard from dept. armorers the excuse "well, if you're in a gunfight, at least all the cops will have the same ammo if it's an extended battle". Everyone doesn't wear the same pair of shoes, so why should we all have the same guns..
Satan_3pc
05-30-2010, 11:54 AM
only a guess but i would say because dept. need standardization. If an officer decides he want a .44...the first criminal shredded by it..the lawyer will be claim cruel and unusual punishment. If a dept is standarized, they cant claim excessive force used...just my .02 FWIW
That said, I agree with you
lol maybe Dirty Harry ruined it for everyone.
Some of the local law enforcement agencies are getting better with what they allow. Personally if you all use the same ammo, I am not going to take your ammo, that usually means the man is down and I will just take his gun instead.
Frontline
06-01-2010, 08:13 PM
As one of the guys in the loop on this, its fairly simple, Training costs (gotta have ammo, LOTS!) standardization, and INSURANCE LIABILITY. As stated before, Dirty Harry jaded insurance Co.'s pretty good!
My agency pretty much lets you carry any good quality 9mm auto (or 357 wheelgun) as long as it has some kind of decocker or safety. Polymer or metal frame, nite sites or regular, lasergrips too.
We issue 9mm Beretta 92 FS, but you can buy yer weapon of choice, as long as it passes the smell test with us at the armorers/instructors bench.
We have varieties of Beretta's, HK's, Sigs, Taurus', Smiths, and even a reserve officer with a CZ75-B
backups include but are not limited to, AMT Backup,Ruger LCP, Colt Pony & Mustangs, SW 442 / 340PD, Taurus 85 ultralight 38, Taurus Millenium compact, etc...
We're allowed extended mags, as long as they are of excellent Mfr ( factory, MDS Italy, etc.)
Most all of us had our own AR15's, but the department wanted them standardized for officer safety, we had some REALLY tricked out EBR's here, some were pretty intimidating to the less experienced shooter. We just aquired DPMS Carbines, ALL with 16" barrels and the standard carbine package. Im trying to convince the Chief to go with Spectre Single point slings, it makes transitioning to your sidearm MUCH easier. See my Blog here for a pic of my latest !WIN!, maybe my luck will hold out and I can get the single point slings.
We've even gone as far as to see what mags are "interchangable", in that you can "teacup" the mag wih your weak hand and hold it in, and the slide will strip rounds. Its an interesting scenario training when you actually employ it.
Anyway, thats all I got.
Satan_3pc
06-01-2010, 08:26 PM
Wow you issue Berettas? I haven't seen a cop wearing one of those in ages...
Frontline
06-01-2010, 08:41 PM
Wow you issue Berettas? I haven't seen a cop wearing one of those in ages...
Yeah, we seem to have bypassed the Glock immersion program. Seems my chief is emphatiically against glocks being issued or carried. I have my theories as to why, but its his house and his rules.
Satan_3pc
06-02-2010, 12:31 AM
Well Beretta is not a bad gun at all. In fact my Dad being 52, and rather old school, prefers it. It's just sort of old tech.
BrooklynBacon
06-02-2010, 02:19 AM
FHP all carry Beretta's...I've seen a couple cops in Miami-Dade County PD carrying them too..
JaxChris
06-02-2010, 03:04 AM
All the FHP I knew in Jacksonville had Glock 22's... so maybe FHP institutes standards by region? I've been friendly with a number of cops up there from FHP, JSO, and SJSO.
Frontline
06-02-2010, 07:59 AM
Well Beretta is not a bad gun at all. In fact my Dad being 52, and rather old school, prefers it. It's just sort of old tech.
I seen no reason why a proven and dependable design should be dropped for the latest and greatest because its "old tech" .
Satan_3pc
06-02-2010, 09:44 AM
Two reasons. The polymer frame is lighter, and when the slide is back on the polymer gun the barrel tilts back, which is suppose to prevent feeding issues. That is not to say that the Berretta is a unreliable gun. Many have said the 1911 is one of the most reliable guns, and that's as old as it gets. But then you a heavy metal gun that only holds 7 rounds of .45 ACP.
BrooklynBacon
06-02-2010, 01:55 PM
I think a 1911 is a status symbol of sorts...that's why guys carry them..besides being dependable, its what every gun owner wants in their collection..
anthony20031
06-02-2010, 02:46 PM
Yh I want one lol
Satan_3pc
06-02-2010, 03:03 PM
I want one, but not until I have my top priority guns first and extra cash. They are nice solid guns.
Two reasons. The polymer frame is lighter, and when the slide is back on the polymer gun the barrel tilts back, which is suppose to prevent feeding issues. That is not to say that the Berretta is a unreliable gun. Many have said the 1911 is one of the most reliable guns, and that's as old as it gets. But then you a heavy metal gun that only holds 7 rounds of .45 ACP.
Well, technically, the drop block on a 92 keeps the barrel movement to a minimum as it slides on a track in the frame. The trigger bar placement makes the magazine position optimal on the 92 for very reliable feeding. It's open slide makes double feeds almost impossible, but if it happens, it is easiest to clear. So, I'll give you lighter, but I won't give you more reliable. In fact, we had a Glock come into the shop that would fire fine but as soon as the client's light was mounted to the rail, the dynamics of the flexing of the frame changed and it suddenly couldn't feed reliably. IIRC, the problem went away by switching to a smaller and lighter rail light.
Satan_3pc
06-02-2010, 08:53 PM
Fascinating. Sounds like one for the XD, one less for the Glock! ;) lol
Fascinating. Sounds like one for the XD, one less for the Glock! ;) lol
Ha ha! sure if you want to look at it that way, but, the point is that polymer frames flex a lot more. The gun is certainly engineered for that, but little nuiances make some out of the box applications tougher. The 92 platform is actually supposed to be one of the best for suppressor use as it almost is a fixed barrel so no need for a booster but has a delayed breech for efficiency and quietness.
Satan_3pc
06-02-2010, 11:23 PM
Ah, I understand. It makes since. Everything has it's pros and cons.
C3PO has spoken! :ss1:
JaxChris
06-03-2010, 02:13 AM
The 1911 is a dime a dozen weapon because nobody owns the design anymore. This means everyone can make one and nearly everyone does. Because of this flooding of the market, almost everyone wants one to be part of the crowd. Honestly, it is a great pistol but I don't care to have one unless it was going to be for a reason and it would be a safe queen for sure (i.e. Spike's does a special one and I get a good deal as a preferred buyer).
Satan_3pc
06-03-2010, 06:24 AM
I just like the decked out Springfield Armory 1911s. The guy I always talk to at the local gun store has one and that thing just feels and looks nice. Real solid. And I am quite sure I could whatever I want with the sights on it.